Balance with Andy Boote

In this episode of the One Health Podcast Wellbeing Series, Dorian Broomhall gets to know Andy Boote, Senior Project Manager at Health ICT.

Andy talks about finding the right balance at different stages in his working life.

He speaks about finding fulfilment, being a lifelong learner, and accessing support through our Employee Assistance Program. 

Andy also talks about the things he currently does for his own wellbeing, and about the things he knows he could or should be doing.

Transcript

Dorian Broomhall:

Welcome to the One Health Podcast. This episode was recorded on the land of the palawa people. I acknowledge and pay respect to all Tasmanian Aboriginal people and to their deep history of storytelling and shared ways of supporting one another.

My name's Dorian Broomhall. I'm the manager of culture and wellbeing for the Department of Health here in lutruwita, Tasmania. In this second series of the podcast, I'm speaking with people from across our organisation about individual strategies for wellbeing, what the department can do to support the wellbeing of our people, and how managers can influence this at their local level.

In this episode, I got to know Andy Boote, who's a senior project manager for Health ICT. In our conversation, Andy speaks about how important finding fulfilment and being a lifelong learner are to his wellbeing. He talks about finding balance and accessing support through our employee assistance programme. Andy also talks about the things he currently does for his own wellbeing and about the things that he knows that he could, or perhaps, should be doing. So, let's get into it.

Give us a bit of an overview of where you're at in your life right now. And happy for that to be about work, not work-

Andy Boote:

Yeah, sure.

Dorian Broomhall:

... whatever you'd like to do to just set the scene as a brief overview. And I'm really interested in a couple of the steps that you think got you to where you are.

Andy Boote:

Well, hello, my name is Andy and I've been with the Department of Health for 25 years, and I've had 15 jobs in that period. When I say 15 jobs, 15 roles with a variety of different responsibilities, challenges, as well as have met a stack of people delivering our frontline services, heroes in our organisation in terms of delivering care and being there.

So, for me, I never thought I'd be a public servant and I want to talk about the role and fulfilment of public service a bit later on, as part of wellbeing. However, for me, the role I'm in at the moment is in the project management office and that allows me to deliver high-quality projects to both frontline and the people who are behind the scenes, to do their job better, more safely and with benefits that hopefully translate to our community and to our deserving people on this island and group of islands. So, for me to be able to do that in my day-to-day job is cool.

Plus, being in the information technology area, we see some really groovy stuff and we see some innovation that can actually really enable our service delivery to actually go next level. So, I don't know, I think that sounds a bit nerdy, but I like that blend of change and bringing benefit and being able to actually bring individuals and teams from one place to the other. And that, for me, is the stuff that gets me up in the morning and coming to work.

I'll reflect on, I've kind of fallen into this role. It was never my background. I went to uni, I did psychology, thought I'd be a psychologist, and I kind of have in a way, but more in the organisational side of things. But the areas that really interest me, the biological basis of behaviour, so neuroscience, the whole kind of what goes on inside to actually influence our behaviours and how that matters for whether or not we're in the community, or in a job, or wherever. So yeah, I'm rambling a little bit, but I kind of feel this was meant to be, even though I didn't plan on being here.

Dorian Broomhall:

I think that's something that many of us relate to and certainly some conversations that I've had recently of going, think about where you are right now and go, "Oh, probably didn't plan to be here. However, now that I am here, I'm really glad that I am." And for you to have that number of roles in that amount of time, I think speaks to the opportunity that exists in a large organisation like we have, right?

Where I do want to go, Andy, if that's okay, because I think that the flip side of that is that 25 years in one organisation, that requires commitment. From my perspective, that suggests to me that you've found some ways to take care of yourself along the way. Broadly, everybody will have challenges in their jobs at different times, and a good manager or a good perception about this or whatever it might be, or not see the value of what they're doing for the public. And I love that theme of public service, and definitely want to come back to that, but for you to be able to keep turning up in the way that you do and what I know you do, with a big old smile on your face, which is just brilliant. What are some of the ways that you look after yourself to enable you to be able to do that, and that has enabled you to do that for such a long time?

Andy Boote:

I feel the Department of Health, and in fact, any of our agencies, give you the opportunity to really follow your nose in terms of career development. I know some disciplines are very specific. So, if you're in the medical or nursing or allied health, pretty much that ... But I've also seen so many people in those areas develop into managers or jump across and mix a couple of careers together, go back and do some more qualifications.

For me, I am a lifelong learner and that really is a cornerstone of my wellbeing in terms of career and just feeling good about coming to work. The fact that I can waterfall and jump around and try different jobs out, and it's kind of like, it's safe to do it because you're still within the big umbrella of you're employed by the government. And so, for me to be able to do that and follow my nose has been a big motivator.

I think, the last 10 years, I've kind of settled into the same role, but that's more about my children were growing from that 10 to 20 age group. And so, just the parenting and the focus and being there for them, I've really put my career stuff on hold. So, this year and last year, I'm re-energising that, so being able to participate in Aspire as another motivator and enabling for me to go, "Okay, right, I've done the focus on the parenting. I've been able to make my contributions as a project manager within a variety of roles for both the Tasmanian Health Service and the broader Department of Health." But, for me, now then to be able to kickstart it again, bring wisdom and all the stuff I've learned off all the other wise people that have been part of my journey.

And yeah, I've had some cool managers. I've had some really tough managers. I've had a lot of female managers that are kick-ass, that really have really made a difference and really been influential. So, I kind of feel like I've not only been able to find my way, but I've also had some really good people around me.

Dorian Broomhall:

That whole of life part, I don't think gets described like that often enough. And you said something like, "In the last 10 years or so, I wanted to focus on raising the kids and that part of life." Right? How have you viewed that from a time perspective? Was that a conscious decision that it was something that you went, "I need to do this."? Or, is it something that you've looked back on and gone, "Actually, that's kind of happened, but I'm really glad that it has."? How did that work for you?

Andy Boote:

I think it was about balance and I don't think I really had much of a choice. So, I think, for me to be able to be good at all those things, balance the parenting with renovating a house, with all of the things that are real in everyone's lives, to be able to have the opportunity to just focus on one thing and not be too stressed is one part of it. But I also think about the stressful parts of the life balance, and I've got to say that access to things like employee assistance across those times when things were tricky, whether or not it was to do with finance or relationships or general challenges in life, having that access was a constant that allowed me to ... And I'm not necessarily saying everyone needs employee assistance, but I think it's an undervalued service that's there for people and it's got a bit of a stigma to it. I hook into it regularly and it just allows just a bit of a reset. Plus, you're able to debrief.

And I'm not saying I've been through traumatic experiences, they're just normal life stuff, but to have that there at various stages has been cool. I don't want to bang on about that too much, but I think the opportunity to undertake professional development courses, learn. We've got places like the Training Consortium, so I had a part in the formation of that, as well as a participant in various courses. And I think about this building, almost purpose-built for education and learning, and back to that theme of lifelong learning. And I think the name of the building, tunapri mapali, is palawa for lots of knowledge, lots of learning. And to me, the thing that's kept me going in this organisation for 25 years is the ongoing learning and the opportunity to do that, but also to have the flexibility to bring it back a notch and not feel obligated to learn, just to come and do my job each day. So, hope that makes sense. It's kind of like-

Dorian Broomhall:

That makes sense. Yeah. It's really interesting. I want to bring you down a few levels, because you've talked nice and broad and touched on a few parts there, which I think are really interesting. And I think, the stigma around accessing support, however that might be for you. For you, EAPs worked. And for other people, it might not. However, putting your hand up for supports and normalising that, I love that, and it's such an important thing to touch on. But here's a question that's unprompted. What's your morning routine?

Andy Boote:

I feel it's changed over the years. I am a cyclist, so for a lot of my adult life, cycling was part of the morning routine. I think I've changed that now and it's more about really just ... I feel like it's quite humdrum actually, and not as inspirational as those very successful people out there. But really, it does involve just getting up and getting some food into me. Taking a breath. I feel I'm trying to optimise as much sleeping time in my world, so that's important to me. And so, I leave it last minute.

Dorian Broomhall:

Joy living in Launceston.

Andy Boote:

I know, and we're so close to everything, and whether or not it's by car or by bike or public transport, yeah, you're not that far away. So, it's kind of a luxury and I feel like I've indulging in it, but I don't have anything to offer like-

Dorian Broomhall:

What do you mean, you don't get up at 4:30 AM and do-

Andy Boote:

... Bill Gates, and do my meditation, my boxing class, go and pick some blueberries and squash them into a fresh juice. I really feel, yeah, look, I think that's an opportunity for me to do more in the morning. It's beautiful light, good for the brain. It's amazing how many people are up and about when they've had to do an early drop-off or errand for the kids, to actually get out and see how many people are out and about, but got to be doing more of that. So, that's my challenge.

I also, I'm using quite a few apps to monitor things like sleep and I use one to assist with meditation and a few other things. I know that sounds a bit new age, Dorian, and I'm not telling you that because that's what everyone's cup of tea is, but for me, I'm finding access to material through technology is really easy these days. But I think I've probably gone down that path at the expense of actually just getting out there and getting daily ... I'll go for a walk pretty much every day, but I'm not riding daily and I'm not getting out as much. It's more of a weekend warrior kind of lifestyle at the moment, but blessed to be in this space, access to mountains, the beach and everything in between within either a ride or a car drive and a ride.

Dorian Broomhall:

Your routine, as you talk about it, I think it's beautiful because let's take some of the BS out of it. You're optimising the amount of time that you're able to sleep, which is brilliant. You're getting some food, critical, because we know that our brains need protein first thing in the morning, otherwise we're actually not going to work very well. And I can have a debate with all of the fasters out there at a different time, quite happy to do that, as a reformed faster myself. And then, you've got some way of getting to work, some sort of outside time that that's all fine. It doesn't need to be wildly complicated. Has that changed for you over time?

Andy Boote:

I used to commute every day on the bike. I feel when things got busier, particularly over the last 5, 10 years, I feel like that's dropped off and I do use a car more. However, as you'll notice, the parking around here is pretty tight, but there's a lot of two-hour spots. So, I feel like I've started this movement or club called the two-hour shuffle. And while we haven't equipped it with any intelligence, I feel that there should be an app to say, "Hey, I'm moving. You can move into my spot." I feel that gets me out and about. So, trying to break up the day with a bit of outside time and a walk. There's a few hills around here which we can use.

But the question about whether it's changed, I think it has. And again, it's interesting how being approached to do something like this really pinpointed my awareness of, "Oh, hang on, I used to do this, I used to do that. Do more of that good stuff." So, even this opportunity has been a catalyst for just thinking, "Well, okay, should be doing a bit more." So, hopefully people who are watching this and thinking, "Hey, little things that make a difference each day, just stacking those up."

Dorian Broomhall:

And I think that's part of the challenge, right? Is that at different times of our life, we do things quite well and some things perhaps better than others. And for me, right now, I'm not optimising sleep very well because I've got a 1-year-old and it's rough. I haven't slept through the night in 18 months because the few months before he was born wasn't great either, because as it turns out it's no fun being pregnant, not for me, for my wife, of course. But yeah, and so sleep's something that I'm finding really tricky, but at different times I suspect that will come back again.

But I think that, perhaps, we overdo the pressure of you need to optimise everything all of the time. And I think that's nonsense, because I think that if you zoom out over that arc of 25 years and think about, "Well, what's sustainable for me and to keep me well, healthy, and to keep turning up?" Being able to think in that longer timeframe, I think is quite useful, because there's almost this downside, you used the word stress, I'll use the word pressure, and this term that we've started talking about a bit, we manufacture the pressure on ourselves that we have to have all of this done by the time we get to work at nine o'clock or whatever it is, and that we've had our ice bath and we've had our 37.5 grammes of protein, and we've had 15 to 20 minutes of sunlight and you've done your zone two exercise, and this and that and whatever. And that's great, and if you can do those things, that's awesome. But that longer term, what do you think the answer is, Andy, how do we do sustainability at a longer term?

Andy Boote:

I feel a lot of it comes down to the individual, it's self-directed. For example, I'm in a role that's got a fair bit of flexibility. I'm in a job that has a fair bit of ... And an organisation that allows that through all of its employment clauses. So, to be able to take some time out to do something or to sustain that balance. But I know that for our people on the front line, that isn't necessarily the case and they're under the pump, they are under that pressure. So, not only have they got their lifestyle, but they hit the ground running when they start their shift. And so, while being more in a back office role, I feel that's been good, it actually suits me, but other people thrive on that pressure, but they also might make a few career changes.

I think the big picture for that balance is to do what works for you and to be curious. Like, for me, while there might be opportunities through the community organised stuff or the organisation organised stuff, I feel like a lot of that, for me, is self-directed. So, that's the kind of satisfaction I get from going, "Okay. Well, I'm going to do that." It's kind of weird though, because if you don't do it, the only person you let down is yourself rather than contracting. I really feel that in our organisation being health focused, there could be more opportunity for that to be common. So, whether or not it's popups around nutrition or sleep. Or, they did the skin checks down here, "Cool. Free. Wow." It's a preventative thing. To have that and do, "Okay. Well, yeah, I'm going to get a skin check because that's available." Or, "I'm going to do a six-minute intensity session because that's cool. I've got a room and there's actually a few other people on my building, in my floor, that are interested in that stuff." But how do I know that? Well, I don't, unless I talk.

I think if you look at the individual versus organisational, whose responsibility it is ... And I know you guys are doing a lot, the team are doing a lot around ... Whether or not it's the gym membership staff, or it's webinars or whatever that is, I know you are making a big effort, but I also feel that stuff is just not talked about. And it's like, unless you make the effort as an individual, you're not going to hook into that. And I think that's where the reinforcement and that culture of health and wellbeing, because I look around and a lot of the work I do, if I'm dealing with frontline people, I tiptoe around them because I know how busy they are, and they look tired and they look ... I'm not saying everyone, but they go hard. I'm grateful for the fact I've got that flexibility, but I've also got a level of self-awareness. But some people are just on that wave and they may not have that.

And I think if there's an offering and other people are doing it, that's the kind of thing that starts to build the normality around health and wellbeing conversations, because we think, keep all that stuff, that's out of work stuff. And at work, I'm doing my job, but incorporating it, whether or not it's six minutes or two minutes, or moving the car, or walking with some colleagues around the block, or some park time, or whatever that is.

Dorian Broomhall:

There's a remarkable number of strategies that you've identified in there, Andy, that again, are small things that we might not even think that we're doing for our health and wellbeing, yet, are probably having an impact. And yeah, I suppose that our perspective is that we want to reduce the barrier to entry. So, if someone wants to make a choice to go, "Actually, I could have a look at this a little bit differently and there probably are some things that I could do. I don't know where to start." That's where I see our role to play.

And I think the other role that I'd like to play, before we wrap this up, your insight on, is helping our managers who are within the organisation with the ability to understand what their influence actually is. And I think that there's a perception there of, oh, well service pressure or delivery pressure or whatever it might be, that's actually what's more important. And not always taking that 10-year view of an employee or a situation, or whatever it might be, to enable that sustainability.

Now, I don't think that we're equipping them to do so. So, this is again, something ... It's not a stab at a manager for being any sort of way. It's about helping them realise what their influence is and what they can do differently. As someone who's had a number of different managers, as you've said, and you're a leader in the organisation as well, is there any advice that you might give to a manager who might be listening to this, who goes, "Gee..." Whatever my context is, whether it's we've got an office situation, so flexibility is much easier, or you are working in that clinical operational delivery where it's much more difficult. What piece of advice would you give to somebody who wants to cultivate their environment to enable sustainability for staff?

Andy Boote:

I think one of the constructs that enable that is community. And I think sometimes managers feel like they are on their own or they're responding or reacting to things. I think for managers listening, hey, take some time to actually build your team and be talking about different ways, flexible ways, creative ways to make this stuff happen. Hook into the team at wellbeing and culture, talk to them about ideas. But I'd also say, be curious, make time to plan that stuff. Role model it. And that's really easy for someone to say, "Oh, just role model it." Because it really is fundamental behaviour change and human behaviour change is hard.

So, I think that ongoing ... But also, I think, the managing expectations up around building that in. So, the manager's manager and their director, everyone being on the same page around, "Well, hey, we're going to be introducing some more of this good stuff to make more good stuff, rather than feeling like we need to squeeze it in." And I feel that that's where, look at it as an opportunity and investment.

And again, I feel like I'm really using lanky words, but I really ... If there is a clear message from Kath all the way down to say, "Hey, this stuff's important. Make time, be creative, be flexible. Try something." As they say in the Aspire programme, safe to fail. What's the worst that can happen if you try something? And encourage that feedback and refinement. I know, again, that it's easy for me to sit back in my back office job and say that. However, that should be part of ... We've got so many long-term managers and people who have worked their way through, but the culture they know is that grindstone culture, and that gets passed down. So, I feel like there's got to be a bit of a flip somewhere that introduces that and showcases that. I think that's what you're doing with this series. So, hopefully.

Dorian Broomhall:

Baby steps, I think. And yeah, I think that frame, safe to fail, is something that we talk about through our diversity, equity and inclusion principles. One of them is safe to learn. Same sort of concept, right?

Andy Boote:

Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Dorian Broomhall:

Same idea, just a slightly different focus. I think your point there of managers inheriting ways of working and role modelling other people's ways of working, it needs to be safe for them to learn as well. And for them to have a go and try things, and know-

Andy Boote:

Be supportive.

Dorian Broomhall:

... that it might be difficult. Yeah, exactly. And not just be expected that overnight there'll be profound change.

Andy Boote:

Yeah. Plug in the module.

Dorian Broomhall:

That's right. Job done. And now all of a sudden, I'm wellbeing.

Andy Boote:

Yeah.

Dorian Broomhall:

No. I think you make a good point. And yeah, just having patience for people to be able to do that and helping to support them to do that as well. I think it's a ... Yeah.

Andy Boote:

And it's interesting, one thing I've observed over the years, the access and availability of free stuff or consumable stuff, waxes and wanes depending on who's doing what. And I think that is something I'm seeing a comeback, a big comeback in a really positive way. I know some of the drivers behind that, there's some mandate, but I actually think we do it because it's a good way to work and it's a good way to show, hey, we want our individuals and our families and our communities to be healthy, but we've got to be healthy ourselves, to be able to provide that service and that care.

Dorian Broomhall:

Great spot to finish. And Andy, thank you so much for your time and your reflections of 25 years of learning and your passion and commitment to the organisation and its people. We really appreciate it. So, thank you.

For this season of the podcast, I'm actually trying something different at the end of each episode. It's always so interesting listening back to a conversation sometime after you've had it. And what really strikes me about the conversation with Andy is he really takes the woo out of wellbeing in the most genuine possible way. There's all these implicit strategies that he doesn't even realise that he's doing. And many of us have got these as well. And I think it's so important to realise and reflect and remember that so many of us are actually striving to take care of ourselves even if we aren't doing the Tim Ferriss 4:30 AM special or whatever it might be.

I think the main takeaway that I've got from that conversation on reflection is this idea of time and that you might do different things at different times in your life. And if you zoom out over a larger time period, you might focus in on work for a period and building your career and focusing in on that. And other times, you might need to just cruise that a little bit and focus in on family or whatever else might be going on for you. And I think that that idea that we've got the choice to be able to do that, or hopefully we've got the choice to be able to do that, and place our attention on different things. And for Andy as well, his exercise or getting on the bike might be like that too. Some years might have more Ks in the legs than others, and realising that that's actually okay and a reasonable strategy rather than beating yourself up if you didn't make it to the gym six times this week. It's such a fantastic and refreshing way to think about it.

I also love that outside of perhaps some of our pillars of wellbeing that we like to talk about, that this constant learning and having a real purpose for doing what you do, can be such a motivator for keeping us well and that wellbeing linking to having meaning in your work and what you do. I think that's something we probably need to talk about even more, because all the evidence is saying it's important. And I know for me, personally, I also, I really enjoy that and I do think it's important too.

So, if we go through the six pillars with what Andy's talked about, what he's touched on, whether he meant to or not, he talks about maximising the amount of time that he sleeps and the joy of living in Launceston and not Sydney. You can really do that, because your commute's going to be much shorter. He talks about fueling up in the morning as part of his nutrition to get the brain moving and get started there. A lot of reference to movement with cycling and also walking, but noting that his relationship there has changed over time and there's nothing wrong with being a weekend warrior and getting a bit of that movement in.

Interesting, his social connection reference was about community within the team and how you can really get that social connection. My words, through that community is words that can be cultivated within a team environment. And that's certainly something me, again, personally, I really get, I get good social connection at work. And of course, he refers to the beautiful light in the morning in Launceston. And for those that have been in Launceston in the morning, I grew up there, it is a particularly beautiful light, when the fog's not blocking it, of course.

And for stress regulation, the two-hour shuffle, I don't think he necessarily meant it like that, but you got to move your car around the block every two hours and get a bit of a walk in, gee, tell you what, that's going to shake up your day and, I think, regulate your stress really, really nicely. Yeah. Yet another really interesting conversation and a completely different perspective how we might be able to think about wellbeing. And I think coming back to that idea is you're probably already doing some good stuff, so perhaps we don't need to overthink it. Thanks, Andy.